Hi Dave, All the references I looked at seemed to suggest any black in the throat of Dickcissel meant it was a male also. Also, the more extensive chestnut patch also indicates male, which I also thought I was seeing. I'm not familiar with the "Pyle" book you are reffering to. Could you please post the full title, author's name and ISBN number so I can get my hands on one ? I was just using the National Geo guide as a reference. Are there other good references that discuss Dickcissel in detail ? In any case, I'm thrilled Stan found that bird. I bird there every day, and most times I don't give those Weaver Finches a second look. I may have to change that strategy. Of course, in the spring I'm too busy looking for warblers. Thanks in advance and Merry Christmas, Darius Ecker (eckerd@prodigy.net) Columbia, Maryland. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Mozurkewich" <dm@fornax.usno.navy.mil> To: "MDOsprey Mailing List" <mdosprey@ARI.Net> Sent: Friday, December 17, 1999 2:07 PM Subject: [MDOsprey] Dickcissel at Lake Elkhorn In Howard County > > Darius, > > I, too, was surprised when I saw the black on this bird's throat. (I > found it about 10:15 last Sunday.) There were black specks all the way > along the upper edge of the yellow and they coagulated into a distinct > black spot at the center of the throat (left to right, not up/down). I > finally made the time to check Pyle's book and, IF I understand what he > says, any black on the throat implies that this bird is a male. > > Dave > > Seabrook, MD USA > dm@fornax.usno.navy.mil > > P.S. Even though e-mail travels rapidly, there is no guarantee that it > gets sent, read or processed in such a timely manner. > > On Tue, 14 Dec 1999, Darius Ecker wrote: > > > For those interested, the Dickcissel was seen Monday morning, September > > 13 at 8:15 AM in a small tree embedded in a multiflora rose at the > > lakes's edge behind the Townhouses next to the dam at Lake Elkhorn. The > > bird is still with a large group of Weaver Finches. I got to watch it at > > close range (15 feet) for five minutes, before it dropped down below the > > bank into the brambles and dissappeared. This was a tough bird for me to > > see, and I put in well over fours hours of trying before finally seeing > > it. > > > > It was worth the wait. But I thought I could see black at the base of > > the feathers in the throat, and a fairly pronounced chestnut patch on > > the wing. The yellow on the breast was also more extensive than I was > > expecting for a female. Could this bird be a male Dickcissel in winter > > plumage instead of a female ? Can the female show traces of black at the > > throat ? > > > > Darius Ecker (eckerd@prodigy.net) > > > > Columbia, Maryland. > > > > >